"Goodbye you needy, distracting pain in the arse; my mother was right about you"
Paul Carr
What is it that makes Ecademy so hideously unattractive, so akin to a happy clappy cult? Members I've come across are a mix of no hopers straight out of the Stepford Wives and evangelists offering to give you the confidence you didn't know you didn’t have.
Ok, I'm a bit angry with them so may come across a bit strong but I'm trying to be unbiased. Ecademy can't be all that bad? Feedback from members is excellent. In fact you never see a bad comment. Take a look at this one:
"I am an avid Ecademist. It is a network which works - has dynamism and serves its members. The founders are untiring in keeping a personal relationship with the members. By comparison - Linked-in, Xing etc are cold and impersonal."
This was posted underneath one of the best TechCrunch UK articles ever which I'll come back to in a moment.
It seems you are either an Ecademy type or you’re not. I'm happy to say I'm not. Like thousands of others I naively joined when I started a business many years ago and am still on their database counting towards their 1.9 million members. As co-founder (Billy Graham understudy) Thomas Power has confirmed, only 190,000 active members log on a month so it's hard to estimate how many of those 1.9 million have lapsed but it has to be a good few hundred thousand. Since I joined I have been regularly contacted by the type of people I define as freaks (a true Ecademist would be a little more complimentary). My first ever read:
"If you want any introductions to other Ecademy members then please let me know. I have about 150 people in my online network covering most skills, and I am quite good at finding 'horses for courses'. My company works with growing businesses with a specialisation in fresh thinking and creating new ideas that will aid growth. If you want to have a chat sometime and bounce some ideas around then please do give me a call.
Good luck
Simon Read
www.simonread.com"
150 people - whoopeedoo! He was so good at 'horses for courses' that his website no-longer goes to a site about him, it's now 'parked' by acquirethisname.com and temporarily redirects to an online poker site. Of course I could be wrong. Maybe Mr Read decided that dot coms were so 2007 and went for a dot name instead. I can't really be bothered to check. Ok, bit of bad luck with that one, perhaps if I'd responded to him all those years ago things could have been different for simonread.com. My next message read:
"Hello. I notice that you are new to Ecademy. I'd like to say hello and welcome. It’s a very friednly (sic) place here...Wishing you well,
A.
www.sparkleinbusiness.co.uk"
Leave me alone! I hate all this American false friendliness! Poor A. It seems she's no longer 'sparkling in business' either. But I bet she's still counted in the 1.9 million members.
OK forget the messages, you get the gist. On to compatibility. Finding other 'members like me'. A great idea for a feature - if it works. So, let's see who I'm like. One click later and there are pages of people like me. Just like me. Magic!
Not giving away any names, here’s who I match with: someone who offers profile makeovers; someone working for the University of Life; An intuitive leader from Intuitive Leadership LLP; a WiseTiger; two life coaches; and this business guru:
"If you have ever wanted to speak in public without fear and in a way that makes others want to listen -- I can help. If you have even wanted someone to help you to write better speeches, presentations, promotional material and sales letters, talk to me. If you have ever wanted someone to deliver your presentations for you, write your direct mail, brochures, speeches, websites -- I'm your man."
So, do I need to give you my feelings on the subject or are they clear enough. And I haven't even got on to their events yet, or their weirdo, loves the sound of his own voice, 70's throwback Mike Southern - The Beermat Entrepreneur. Another time.
Yesterday I read Penny (co-founder and wifelet of Thomas) Power's latest blog. I was very nearly ill. The tone, the smugness, she really has no idea how she sounds which is totally clear from reading more of her blogs all in the same tone.
Please read it here
There's no matter of fact in this article at all. Just a bunch of sentences that sound nice and make Penny sound even nicer. "In ten years we have never argued, never disagreed on the strategy" / "I call myself the Heart of Ecademy, I am the 'Intention', Thomas is the 'Brain' of Ecademy, the thought leader and the head of the community; Glenn is our 'Nervous System', he keeps us all working, joins us up, he is our CEO, he is the 'Tools" / "Everyday, when I am on the computer, answering messages, when I am training, speaking or meeting members, I have only them in my thoughts "what can we do to help your business get stronger", that is why I get up in the morning. That is why I love Ecademy."
So, a rare occurrence for me, I decided to post a comment.
"That has to be the most sycophantic, smug, self-appreciating article I have ever read. Do you look at yourself in the mirror every morning and tell yourself how great you are"
Within minutes my account was suspended. So I wrote to Thomas and told him how I resent the policing system they have which only keeps the nice articles showing. He did respond but not with any real explanation.
I want to refer you back to Mike Butcher's piece back in February. It was only a short piece just about the company being ten years old. You can read it here. Nothing special except for Thomas Power's lack of clarity on their numbers. It was the comments that followed that really made this incredible reading.
In summary, after the article the first few comments were pretty genuine. Then suddenly a flurry of comments appeared that were not just pro Ecademy but real loyalist kind of stuff. Mike Butcher then suggested that these were being prompted by the Power's. It then transpired that Thomas had, in fact, put a link to the article on his blog as well as on Twitter. Thomas and Penny also both put their defensive comments in. It didn't stop there. One of the Power's business partners Roger Hamilton was then cited in a few subsequent postings. At the time he was being investigated on a number of claims that he was extracting money from small businesses by dubious means. One of the actual claimants also posted a comment. Mike ultimately had to close the piece. This one sneaked in, and as it was on TechCrunch, it was not hidden like mine:
"I was a member of Ecademy but got fed up with the Law of Attraction rubbish. Apparently people can state, for instance, that the Jews brought the Holocaust upon themselves, or that cancer sufferers attracted the disease to themselves and still remain as members of Ecademy. But don’t mention Roger Hamilton, the well known scam artist, you will be thrown out immediately."
We can speculate quite a lot from this. 1) Can the Power's take constructive criticism? - I guess we'll see soon enough 2) Do they over manipulate their own images to come off as squeaky clean friends of the small business - in a kind of Scientologist style? 3) Are there fascist undertones within their leadership? I'm not suggesting there are, just speculating, and 4) Are they involved in any of the alleged scams that their business partner Roger Hamilton was?
Who can say? But I can tell you this. I don't want any part of their organisation in my life. They have created a community that is a breed of its own and I'm very proud to say I'm not an Ecademist.
Goodbye Ecademy
Posts
21 comments:
Another, extremely dull and frankly boring attack on Ecademy.
If you don't like it, why do you bother with it? You've made your point, but are clearly in the minority so why don't you just go away?
Huge numbers of people get a great deal of value from Ecademy - so why not just leave them alone, instead of insulting them?
The Powers work very hard to create an environment which has a lot of value for a lot of people - but clearly it doesn't work for you. So go away and try and do it better if you can.
You're hiding behind a Blogger account so I suspect you'll moderate this comment out anyway.
Pierre
Never have so many people with so little talent gathered in one online community to agonize over topics of no consequence.
Welcome to Ecademy: Networking for the intellectually subpar and the socially awkward.
Thomas Power puts the "cad" in Ecademy, one network connection at a time. His wife Penny makes Victoria Beckham look like Richard Feynman.
People have different experiences, which is what makes the Internet such an interesting place. If you don't like a community, you can leave and join another with no consequence. You can even start your own community, virtually for free with websites like Ning.com or KickApps.com!
I think it is interesting that people feel the need to be negative about an experience that really did them no harm. They just didn't like it. They have a personality conflict with someone, or just don't like the features. I can understand trying to be a watchdog for fraud, or scam spam, but this situation is clearly a personal opinion. No foul no harm. You can't be all things to all people.
As a disclaimer, I am an Ecademist, and enjoy the conversations I have there. Developing relationships is what Ecademy is about. If you don't like the presentation, or feel the owners are phony, that is your personal choice. I have had good conversations with both Thomas and Penny. We don't agree on everything, but we can agree to disagree. And we don't let our differences get in the way of liking each other as people. I actually admire Thomas and Penny for what they have gone through to create such a fantastic network!
Needless to say they have done something right. They continue to attract new users regularly. Some with noble intentions, others just looking to spam. But once you let go of your preconceived ideas of what networking "should" be and allow yourself to be exposed to new ideas, a new way of doing business, then a whole new world of possibilities open up. It's actually a very special place on the world wide web.
Keeping the community free of negativity creates and fosters a nurturing environment. You can clearly disagree with anything said, but it is HOW you choose to disagree where the line is drawn. Flaming attacks, or insults are not productive and distract from the development of a positive, thriving environment.
I can accept your position, as you clearly haven't had a good experience. That could be Ecademy's fault for not being able to cater to your specific needs, or it could be your fault for looking through tainted glasses. But the experience is yours to share. I appreciate being able to share mine with you! While I hope I could change your mind, I don't expect to.
Maybe we can connect elsewhere, on one of the other many networks such as MySpace or Facebook or a Ning Community.
Thanks again for allowing me some space on your blog to give a differing opinion.
I have been on ecademy for four years, reached 855 connections and made several thousand pounds out of it.
I enjoy it and I can fully understand that some people would hate it. There are loads of good people on there and quite a few nut cases. Thankfully just like in real life I can usually spot them.
I would love it to be more democratic but in the end it is a private limited company owned by people who have their own ideas of what they don't like and therefore the perfect right to remove content and people.
They do seem to have been very protective of Roger Hamilton but then again he is very litigious and they are effectively the publisher as owners of the site so there may be some self preservation in there somewhere.
If you look at Thomas's original Blackstar membership it was based on Hamilton's XL Life membership idea. He made it an elite community within a community and charged £3,000 life membership which he said could be transfered.
I have been told that Thomas and Penny Power have been distancing themselves from Hamilton because they fear his bad publicity may reflect on them and they are right, it will. Hamilton and XL frequently refer to Thomas Power as one of their guru's to promote their Life Membership costing $10,000. He is indeed a guru but you can connect to him very easily for just £10 per month so there is no need to spend $10,000.
I was therefore surprised to read Penny's blog saying that Roger Hamilton was one of two people that she really admired. I know Penny to be a very decent honest person so I am disappointed to read this statement.
However, to conclude, if you think you have a better model than ecademy then why don't you just set it up and then you can get as many members as they have paying you at least £10 per month each and you too will be set for life.
Developing relationships is what life is about. Ecademy is a forum for recording people’s perspectives, viewpoints, experience and opinions. The heavy-handedness of Thomas, Penny and Glenn to glaze people’s interchange with a dense coat of saccharine is grossly offensive.
I left Ecademy of my own accord 4 years after I joined. Each stretch of 5 months brought about major reversals of ‘ethos’ and the management’s hypocrisy when implementing any code of behavior was, frankly, an insult to my intellectual capacity.
I agree that the platform belongs to Power, Power & Watkins and it is theirs to run as they see fiscally fit; I do take issue with the exploitation of certain members for the benefit of the Powers and their site. There’s a history there, trust me. I take extreme exception to the lack of integrity in reporting both membership totals and activity on their site with the intention of drawing more members in. Luckily the members on the fence who do join often choose not to participate for lack of any type of mental stimulation coupled with the greasy feeling one gets from the round-and-round repetitive rah-rah for Thomas and Penny. The Powers administer an online database of people who – I’m not kidding – spend hour after consecutive hour posting threads all day, every day in many cases, on the home page or in clubs. What does that tell you? Who are these people who refuse the public dignity to manage their time well? Who equates online networking as some sort of professional accomplishment?
Or more to the point, who are the people pandering to these members who wile away hours – and their adult life -- on the internet?
You say, “Needless to say they’ve done something right” but don’t pornographers do something right by continuing to attract new users regularly. Scam artists and con men do the same thing as well. Please don’t construe offsetting expenses of an internet site as doing “something right”: there are people selling low-end crap on eBay who can make the same claim and often these people haven’t left their parents’ basement or even bathed for months.
Qualify, in very concrete terms, how you measure success and see if Ecademy doesn’t fall very short of the mark in each of those instances.
Please keep in mind, Ecademy is a tool and not a way of life … although some of their most active members could be described as having been tools all of their life.
Well Mollie,
We have a difference of opinion. I have no problem with that. You are no more right than I am. We come from different places, different experiences and different objectives with how we view life. You are entitled to your opinion and I won't tell you that you are wrong. There is a history with everyone, every company, every website. You will be hard pressed to find one that doesn't have detractors. Ecademy is no different. It is a reflection of the real world. What I do know is there are more people happy with their experience than those that are not. And again, that is true of every website. Thanks for sharing your experience.
I was directed here by Thomas Power.
Pierre Rydale said...
Another, extremely dull and frankly boring attack on Ecademy.
I didn't think it was dull, I thought it was well written, not boring at all, an attack on Ecademy?
Well they are bound to happen arn't they? People are very jealous about people that have found something nice in the world.
It's easy to be nasty, critical, indeed many people are brought up that way, even myself, I have the capacity to follow what I call the "old way" the way my parents brought me up.
However I have found something better, I am still learning it so I get it wrong sometimes, being nice to people all the time is difficult, but once you get the hang of it it's much more rewarding.
You carry on, the way you are following is not bad, it is just different, your way finds it difficult to accept "differences" my way seeks out the differences.
Well it will do when I get it right!
What a fantastic thread! Some real extremes of opinion here.
Markaorr sums up my feelings about Ecedemy:
"I have been on ecademy for four years, reached 855 connections and made several thousand pounds out of it."
Several thousand pounts after 4 years of networking? That strikes me as a poor return. Thomas Power himself tells people that it will take 2 years to really see the benefits of Ecademy. For me, 2 years spent doing anything with no return would be a complete waste of time.
To compare, a quote from one of our members, which you'll also find on my Ecademy profile:
"If we get this third one in then WeCanDo.Biz will have scored us more work than any of the other online forums/directories we're a member of... you'll be in for one hell of a referral."
Daniel Lyddon, Seraphim Pictures
To me, Ecademy doesn't produce a good enough business return for the time spent, plain and simple. Unless, of course, you measure return in the sort of clap-trap that life coaches measure it in. In which case I would argue it is not a business site at all.
Ian Hendry
WeCanDo.BIZ
Forgot to add - our site has been live for 2 months. That is the sort of return we were aiming for when we build it. Owners of businesses are always short of time, but never of advice.
Ian Hendry
WeCanDo.BIZ
Isn't it interesting that within hours of publishing this Blog Thomas Power goes into action by encouraging his followers to make comments both here and on Ecademy. However he has banned me from making any comments on the Ecademy forum itself. Unban me Thomas and I'll keep it to the point!
George, here is a personal invitation to join our networking site and connect with me.
We'd love to help you out with leads and referrals. I am afraid there is no open chat on ours, however, so I can't help you with your last appeal! ;-)
Ian Hendry
WeCanDo.BIZ
Love the comment "Another, extremely dull and frankly boring attack on Ecademy" which infers it happens quite a bit.
I joined Ecademy about 8months ago, thankfully I am sensible enough to keep my money and not pay to be a blackstar or whatever it is. On joining I was bombarded with automated messages of love which quite frankly are cultish in their tone, this was alarm bell number one!
Many further alarm bells rang relatively quickly and I am pleased to say that I will never use nor recommend the powers cult to anyone.
From a pure social media aspect it has to be one of the poorest attempts at design I have ever seen. The site is all over the place, my kids could do better than that!
As for networking the chap that said "855 contacts in four years and $10,000 made from it" WHAT!!! is that all, in four years, give it up my friend it's not working, if you are only making a couple hundred bucks a month something is not right.
I, like others have several networks such as Facebook (more for friends) Twitter, WeCanDo.BIZ etc. The one that has generated the most business for me is WeCanDo.BIZ. Twitter has connected me with people I could never have located otherwise and has resulted in many meetings and business relationships.
Ecademy has taken real world networking events where you stick a badge to your lapel saying "i'm networking are you?" and transposed it to the web, hence blackstars and POWERnetworkers, it doesn't fit.
As to the figures using Ecademy I reckon its in the low thousands if that. If you spend some time looking round the site their seems to be an elite group (small maybe 200) that work it hard, but that's it.
As more useful networking platforms emerge so will Ecademy fade.
I do find some of these posts mildly offensive and therefore quite negative.
I have no idea if anybody thinks I am a follower of Thomas Power or not. I came to this blog because I have a Google news alert running to keep an eye on Roger Hamilton. I haven't been told by anybody to come here unless you count Google.
I said I had made several thousand pounds out of ecademy after four years membership and this seems have been interpreted by at least two of you. To put this in perspective I have paid £480 for my membership and I have made £20,000 directly from contacts on there giving me business. That is over 40 times my financial investment and if I got that from all my marketing I would be much better off by now.
However, I don't use ecademy as a sales pitch. I have received some great information from other members and made use of some of that. I cannot quantify what this information would have cost me or what it has made me because I don't count it. I also don't spend my every waking hour on ecademy. I pick it up and drop it as and when I have the time and the inclination.
A web expert has told me that the SEO I get from the site is worth more than the £10 per month that I pay.
Following requests from here I have joined WeCanDo.BIZ and I hope it is every bit as good as you say it is. If it is then I will shout that from the rooftops. There really is no need whatsoever to slag off the competition. It doesn't hurt their reputation, it hurts yours because it makes you look like a really nasty person that people wouldn't want to risk doing business with.
Mark, welcome to WeCanDo.BIZ! I'll look you up on our site.
Let me be clear, I get a fair bit from Ecademy. But I have to put a lot in. A fair exchange? Maybe. But I see a lot wrong with it. That is why I developed an alternative to it - competition as you term it. I think my expressions of how I find it were fair and in no way "slag off" the service. Time is in short supply to many business owners and I think it requires too much of it -- I speak as an owner of two businesses myself. If you are successful or perhaps fighting hard to achieve success I think many social media methods can take too much time and, therefore, are a distraction.
I would be interested in how you'd express your return from Ecademy if you factored in your time, as small business owners surely should.
Ian Hendry
WeCanDo.BIZ
Just another disclaimer from me, I came to this through Twitter. A couple people I follow are on Ecademy and posted a link. Yes, I follow Thomas on Twitter, but it was not he who posted the link.
That said...I too will sign up at www.wecando.biz. I appreciate the link! I look forward to connecting Ian.
Hi George,
I would advise you to have a look at this...
http://ecademythomaspower.blogspot.com/
From around the time they were launching the BlackStar "life" members club. If you need clarification on anything, please email me - steand@gmail.com
I was banned for asking awkward questions about BlackStar and not being 150% positive all the time.
Ste
Hi Charlie,
Just read your comment on Ecademy. I can't respond there as I am banned, but what I can do is state with absolute certainty that the blog I linked to is 100% genuine. Libel? not an option, as it is true.
It always amazes me how many ecademics instantly think it is fabricated. By staying within the cosseted environs of HappyShinyEcadeland, most people aren't privy to the lies that the Powers have told to further their ambitions.
Are you aware of the man who was banned for pointing out that Penny Power had lied about membership statistics during a BBC interview?
Ste,
Thank you for your reply. I appreciate the dialog. Please consider for a moment what you have asked of me. I have no idea who you are and you remain anonymous, so I cannot check your credentials. You link to a blogger page created a couple years ago, with no author...again anonymity. Why on Earth would anyone believe you?
Is it possible what you say is true? Yes. But there is no verifiable truth here. Only hearsay. What you have presented would not hold up in court, as is. Now, if you can provide verifiable facts, that can make your case, then do so and let the truth be known.
Everyone has things in their past they are ashamed of, wish they hadn't done or said. Everyone falls off the path now and again. Is anything you are proposing here evidence of criminal behavior? Or just maybe some unethical decisions? Has anyone truly gotten hurt, financially, physically or emotionally damaged by any of the alleged actions? If so, why has there not been an investigation, and charges? This is all internet gossip. One cannot honestly come to believe that blog without real evidence. How would you feel if someone anonymously tried to defame you with an anonymous user name and anonymous blog?
This type of treatment is not fair. For example, someone cannot just put up an anonymous blog and call someone a rapist and post "emails" that "prove" it. There is something called due process. There needs to be evidence.
All I can say at this point is that my experience at Ecademy and with the Powers themselves has been nothing but positive.
Members hits back here:
http://www.ecademy.com/module.php?mod=club&t=867090#endm
Thomas Power's shonky business partner, Roger Hamilton
Rip Off Roger Hamilton back to prey on consumers
http://perth.norg.com.au/2008/08/12/rip-off-artist-hits-peth-consumers/
Rip Off Artist hits Australia
Traveling Pyramid Scheme targets Perth Consumers – Roger Hamilton and the XL Results Foundation
Individuals of the local business community are warned to do due diligence when dealing with XL Results Foundation pte ltd www.resultsfoundation.com operating a multimillion dollar global Get Rich Quick Investment Scam and Charity Scam.
Warnings against the cult have been issued globally by bloggers, consumer associations, consumer activists, whistle blowers and news media revelations.
Pyramid Scheme operator, Roger Hamilton, Chairman of XL Results Foundation pte ltd will hit Perth from the 12th to 14th August.
Venue: Burswood Entertainment Complex, Perth, Australia.
Australian promoter: Paul Dunn, Results Net Australia operating out of Brisbane.
During the three day Perth Wealth Flight event Hamilton will prey on consumers and attempt to extract USD $12,000 from the gullible for an XL life membership.
XL is a bogus business networking scheme that bilks would-be entrepreneurs for membership money while providing them with non-existent training and networking opportunities.
After parting with thousands of dollars, duped consumers are left empty handed and shame faced.
XL Results Foundation pte ltd has been under international media scrutiny after 150 Singaporean members of the scheme demanded a refund claiming they were duped and cheated by the Chairman of the company, Confidence Trickster Roger Hamilton.
Disgruntled members have been advised to lodge complaints with the Consumer Protection Agency.
Allegations against the company include XL Results Foundation’s revenue source is from the constant recruitment of members into the scam a classic pyramid scheme structure.
Hamilton and his cohorts are using membership funds to stave of legal action and protect the scam from exposure.
(The Federal Trade Commission advises that the practice of getting commissions from recruiting new members is outlawed as "pyramiding."[9]). Pyramid Schemes are illegal worldwide.
Related Links
http://blog.datamanagementsolutions.biz/2008/06/shonky-operator.html
http://www.bizop.ca/blog2/complaints-and-investigations/xl-results-foundation/
http://mingtiandi.com/?p=58
http://www.brilliant4biz.com/category/xl-results-foundation/
http://xlresultsfoundationscam.blogspot.com
http://www.businessesfromhell.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=401
http://www.stuff.co.nz/4287069a6442.html
http://www.pyramidschemealert.org
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/articles/2007/05/30/1180205312469.html
The UK promoter of Roger Hamilton and XL Results Foundation, Daniel Priestley of Triumphant Events was prosecuted by The Australian Competition and Consumer Commission in April 2008 for misleading small businesses and breach of the Fair Trade Act.
This information has been provided to relevant Consumer Associations in the United Kingdom.
http://www.accc.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/814807/fromItemId/621932
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